Pls. Help: Munic Archvs docs corrections. NYC: App Rejected

[kontessa]

Brava, brava, brava!

One positive aspect of the consulate in NYC, is that they seem to be issuing an official statement about mistakes/problems with a case, and what they require to fix them - as they should. Important tip for others: always get everything in writing!

[sforza]

First, Javais, Congratulations! Great perseverance and brilliant bureaucratic navigation. At the end of the day, that is what this entire process is about...
I have a question about something in your post:

"The Birth Certificate was different, that I had to send to Vital Records - which I am still waiting to hear back from. Ms Timbers handles those cases - Since I had less than 1 week to change the birth certificate I sought out other options. Which was visiting theMunicipal Archives every day for 4 days. They said no to all of my requests. I finally got someone to have Mr Kenn Kobb meet with me. I suggest you bypass the bshit and just ask to schedule an appointment with Mr K Kobb directly. He's super nice and easy going.

I, yet again - supplied documentation to show what the errors were, and what they should be. He created me the required letter that I needed. With no hassle - which he certified and I had apostilled and translated. The director Lenore will not do this for you, ask to speak to her supervisor who is Mr Ken Kobb."

So the birth cert you were dealing with was pre-1910 - ie, in the municipal archives. So why were you dealing w/vital records? My understanding is that Vital records washes their hands of the records once they're archived. Second, question: Was Cobb's letter a one-and-the-same - ie, X on the birth cert is the same and Y on the latter docs?
Thanks.

[JavaisLife]

Hi sforza,

I went to the Vital Records office, for they have the power to make changes to birth certificates. I figured it was worth a try. ... If you have the proper documentation to support - they can re-create the municipal archive document and enter it into their database. Which is what the Marriage Record hall did, and what I am waiting for the Birth Certificate corrections to do.

However, the letter I got from K Kobb is not "one-and-the-same" it was a letter that said. ...

"
I am writing this letter in response to correct the errors in the birth certificate of _________ (certificate #xxx of year), that you obtained from the NYC Department of Records/Municipal Archives.

Please be advised that all birth records prior to 1910, have been transferred from the NYC Department of Health to permanent custody of the NYC Department of Records/Municipal Archives along w/ al the marriage records prior to 1938, and all death records prior to 1949, and these vital records, therefore, cannot be amended corrected or changed in any way. However, an examination of this document and related vital records pertaining to _____name____, indicates that "Last Name Spelled Wrong" is a hand-generated misspelling of the family name "Proper Spelling." And the mother's name, "Misspelling" is similarly a hand-generated misspelling of the family name "Proper Spelling." In addition, the mother's name before marriage as indicated on the certificate as "M. Last name" is incorrect; the correct name is "Full first name and Last" and the birthplace should be New York City; not New York.

Sincerely,
The DUDE!

----"

Pretty much he kept the first part of the letter the same, then started to list all the errors as pointed out on the certificate. I had certified documents to back up these errors.

This letter was accepted by the Consulate (thus far) and it seems I may not have had to go the corrections rout. I suggest just getting one of those letters - for it was accepted, and easier to get.

But making a correction at the Marriage Hall is incredibly easy. Its a walkin- walk out process.

Cheers,
Marie

[sceaminmonkey]

How long did it take for them to send you the letter requesting the corrections again? 4 months? do you think it would piss them off if I emailed them after two months? as I read your post marie I get more anxious. Worst part of all this is I got to school across the street from the consulate and I stare at the damn building everyday tempted to just walk in.

[JavaisLife]

Ha, you go to Hunter? I called because I had my brother/Moms appointment. And i Sent an Email. They we Not pleased, but I got my rejection 4 days later in the Mail, so they immediatrly reviewed the Case. What were your errors? Id. See if I would circumvent and start on the correction Process now. The errors they told me about at the Meeting we the exact ones that I got a Letter in the Mail about. So, of anything came up at the Meeting - Rest assured, you should go ahead And get it corrected. The rejection is more like "try again" - i wouldnt worry about it. Its just One Step Closer each Time.


Sorry im writing from my phone....

[sceaminmonkey]

my grandparents marriage certificate has Felix instead of Felice. and my GGP marriage has their ages at the time of marriage off by 2 years marriage messed up. I guess I should start now. You think I will get a letter saying get it corrected? and Yes I go to hunter and live in china town close to the department of records etc so traveling has not been a problem for me which I lucked out on. I feel bad for ppl living in CT who need corrections made because I had a million made.

[sceaminmonkey]

also at the first meeting the only errors they pointed out I got corrected. So what do you think of that? because I know other errors still exist but they did not point them out. yet at the same time I feel like they noticed them but just did not say anything. is it possible they want me to think I got it just to have corrections done again?

[JavaisLife]

I'll put it bluntly like this: they are not trying to fk you and make more work for themselves. If they happen to notice the errors at a later point they will ask you to correct them. The reason? They are putting these documents on file in Italy, and they want a clean document trail. I asked them specifically why I need to change the tiny errors. It makes sense (kinda).... You could either re-correct, so you have a flawless application (which is what I think we are all striving for anyway) or, you can cross your fingers. Just keep in mind, they are not your enemy. They just want it done correctly, and if there are errors- they want them corrected. Less work for them, the bigger smile you'll get ... Which is what I noticed on Friday.

Good luck,
M

[KarenChristino]

So, despite the fact that everyone has said that the Municipal Archives will not change any documents, you have gotten them to change the documents?! Did the Consulate put a time limitation on you or did you just want to have it for your brother's appointment?

Thanks for this posting! I admire your determination. I was already thinking that I'd have to go to Court.

Karen

[JavaisLife]

Hi Karen,

The Municipal Archives actually didn't change my documents. I took the documents from the municipal archives - and brought them over to the vital records office to have the vital records office create a new document and change them. I am still waiting for the birth certificate to be changed.

However, the Marriage Certificate was changed - it took an hour. I had to have all supporting documentation, and death certificates all the way down to myself, so I could ask them to do so.

I had to supply the letter from the Consulate requesting the official change. It really wasn't that difficult. The birth certificate - again - I'm still waiting on. That, was difficult and still pending.

So, for the birth certificate I went back to the Municipal Archives and asked them to write a certified letter (which is what the letter from the Consulate states). Ken Kobb wrote the letter for me. In this thread I had typed what the letter says. I showed documents for the required changes. Mr Kenn Kobb was more than agreeable, but the people at the Municipal Archives itself made it real difficult for me to get to him. I suggest just walk in and ask for a meeting with him directly. Bypass the b-shit.

So to answer your question. The Municipal Archives will not change the documents. The Vital Records will create new documents, so they can make the change. These are two different departments.

The court direction was not looking promissing. I only had a week to change these - because I got the letter from the consulate a few days before my bother and mothers appointment. I didn't want them going in w/ errors on their application. My mother would surly have gotten overly upset from the experience. I wanted to save her from that.

- M

[KarenChristino]

I doesn't sound like it would have been so easy to amend these if you hadn't have all your back-up documents already collected and prepared for the Consulate!

[sforza]

"The Birth Certificate was different, that I had to send to Vital Records - which I am still waiting to hear back from. Ms Timbers handles those cases - Since I had less than 1 week to change the birth certificate I sought out other options."
Javais, I plan to try to secure from the Newark consulate ahead of time the type of ltr you received as your rejection ltr from New York - ie, that the docs have to be changed. In the meantime, I have to deal with Vital Records to change two NYC birth certs - one pre 1910 (ie, archived), one from 1914. I already received a flat-out "no." ("You are not entitled to change these records." And "You cannot change the birth records of deceased individuals.") I don't know if it matters, but I'm not changing the names of the individuals themselves, rather in one case errors to the middle name of the parent and in the other, errors to the maiden name of the mother and ages of the parents.
Is Ms. Timbers the best person to reach out to on these? I'm feeling like I need these amended ASAP, since birth certs are determinative documents which I will use to amend the other 6 vital records that needs amending.
Could you send or pm me her direct contact info? Dealing w/DHMH is a nightmare, particularly the "help" line that is only staffed by an answering service who cannot deal with anything substantive - after you languish on hold for 90 minutes at a time...
Many thanks.

[JavaisLife]

Hi Sforza,

If you have a letter from before 1910 - you can talk to the Director of the Municipal Archives to write you an Official Letter w/ the corrections. It's a lot easier. You can go to the Archives and request to meet with Mr Kenn Kobbs.

Making any changes in the Vital Records is a change. Adding/Removing letters or middle names is technically changing a name. You can change a birth record of a deceased individual - if you have all your documents showing that - that individual is your direct relative.

All of the changes you are describing are making changes to the names (errors in maiden name, mother name, etc.).

Ms Timbers handles the Dual Citizenship process, as well as Death Records and corrections. You will need to go to the Vital Records w/ all of your documents and supporting documentation to have things corrected. You still have to go to the Vital Records office - pick a number - wait on line to get to the window. Once you are at the window you can ask to speak to Ms Timbers or Michael Cordero - both are managers.

I'd send you her direct info - but she isn't going to talk to you, until you have already submitted your documents for corrections. You still have to go down and meet with her and wait on line.

As far as ASAP - A letter from Kenn Kobb takes a few moments (from thea arhcives). Marriage Certificate corrections take 1/2hr - 1 hour. Birth/Death record corrections t takes around 90 days. You will have to submit your documents. Perhaps they will work faster if you get a letter from the Consulate.

So - yeah, you have to go down in person.

Good luck!
Marie

[sceaminmonkey]

I would not be shocked if there is more than one cordero but I dealt with mrs timbers and a JOSEPH CORDERO. he corrected mine and my siblings birth certificates. mrs timbers did the death and birth for my mother.

[sforza]

Thanks, Marie! I'll be hauling myself up there as soon as I can get off work. I think I will need to translate the supporting docs from Italian to English - I'm assuming the translations have to be certified. By whom?